I've been having some strong stances on the Hybrid vs. Pure class discussion / debate / QQfest for awhile.
Basically I believe that Hybrids in no way should be better at something than a pure class. Here's why:
Lets take two extremes, an extreme pure DPS class (mage) and an extreme hybrid class (pally).
The mage was developed to be the class with the single highest damage output in PVE and PVP, AOE and single target. The paladin was developed as a jack of all trade, master of none. The mage's single purpose in group settings was to kick the crap out of the targer. The paladins were supposed to be a utility (for lack of better word) class to fill in where other classes couldn't perform.
In my opinion, a mage should always always always beat a paladin at total dps and damage output. Thinking that a ret pally should beat a mage is rediculous. Mages have no armor, low health, use a ton of mana and pots. Paladins have high armor, high health, can heal them selves, can tank, heal, OR dps. Why should they be the best at everything?
I know I'm ranting and this probably doesn't make sense, but the fact that everybody wants their hybrid class (shaman, paladin, druid, and now deathknight) to be number one in DPS, healing, and tanking is completely stupid.
If a hybrid class is going to be number 1 at tanking, they shouldn't be able to throw on a seperate set of gear and compete for 2-3rd place on dps meters (tank druids).
The one thing I'm worried about in lich king is the generalization of all classes. I don't want my hunter to be effect at AOE or Melee, I don't need a shadow priest to own at dpsing. I need a specific roll for my class so we don't end up with 20 deathknighs and 5 paladins.
/endlatenightrant
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4 comments:
While I can certainly understand your stance, this simply does not work in practice. If a mage will always do more damage than a Ret Paladin, then Ret Paladins will go extinct, as was the case in WoW and BC. Ret Paladins do ok, but not great damage, and have major mana issues, and hence there were almost none.
The problem with the jack of all trades master of none idea is that it is specialization, not generalization, that improves something. If you have to focus on everything, you can't do anything super well, and instead of 3 mediocre healing/tank/dps hybrids, raids will just bring one prot warrior, one holy priest, and one fire mage.
If hybrids should not be as good at dps or tanking compared to the "pure" classes, then Paladins, Shamans, and Druids will be delegated to healing, just as they were in vanilla WoW. That is certainly Blizzards choice, but they need to make that clear, and be prepared for the mass exodus from these classes, already the 3 least played classes in the game.
Naelum
The point I was trying to make is that I don't believe it to be fair to have one class be top DPS, healing, or tanking with the change of talents. I'm not saying they should be mega gimped or anything, in fact I like the idea of having certain abilities and raid utility from certain classes (paladins for buffs, druids for +5% crit, etc), but they shouldn't be topping DPS meters in all raids. For players to be mad at blizz for "gimping their" class in that way just isn't fair.
I agree with you in principle, Momo. But I think it's fair to remember that at least in this particular game, every class is designed to put out competitive DPS numbers. Therefore the only "pure" classes are DPS classes - Hunter, Mage, Warlock, Rogue. There are no "pure" tanks or healers, and everyone other than the four DPS classes can rightly be considered a multi-role hybrids.
What distinguishes everyone is their talent trees, and to a lesser extent, gear selection. The classes that are well-designed (and there is one that isn't IMO) have at least one of their three trees dedicated a specific role. To be viable in that role, the player has to make the choice to invest deeply into that tree at the expense of the others. So, a prot pally can be a great tank but can't hit her way out of a paper bag. A shadow priest can churn out out some fearsome DPS, but you wouldn't want him being the main healer on your tank. Etc. and so on.
Druids are the exception to this rule. For some reason that is quite beyond me, Blizzard chose to design them to be competitive in 4 different roles (splitting out melee DPS and ranged DPS for this case) while only giving them 3 talent trees. Because their melee DPS and tanking trees are one in the same, the feral druid is the only class that can be both a competitive tank and melee DPS at the same time. They are the only true hybrid class in the game at the moment.
No other class can tank High King Maulgar and then 20 minutes later be among the top DPS on Gruul without completely over-gearing for the encounters. There's something fundamentally wrong with that, as it goes against the design of every other class. It's perfectly ok in my mind to allow a single class to be able to tank, heal, and DPS, but they've missed the mark with the druid IMO. Have Balance be the melee/ranged DPS tree and make Feral the tanking tree and you've got yourself a winner. Right now, it's just broken within the current context of the game.
But I digress. lol!
Anyway, I would say that Blizzard has done a very good job at balancing the talent cost/performance of each class (except druids!). And for my part, Momo, I don't think I've ever seen the "pure" DPS classes outgunned by anyone else on a consistent basis without huge gear disparities. Which, I believe, is exactly they way you're arguing it should be. :)
so far I havn't seen hybrids outdpsing pures consistently, what I don't like is the attitude that some people have that the class they play should be the best at everything.
I guess it depends on how they implement class and talent selections in raid settings in lich king. I want to see enoucters that require skills from all classes, not just one or two class (i:E druid healers or pally tanks in ZA, druid tanks on gruul).
I'm just complaining about others complaning though, so it's a pretty moot point :-p
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